BuzzerBeater Forums

I think we should give up MVP vote now (maybe we can implement this feature in the future)

Private league as alternative seems great -did we consider it earlier?
We will have table, top players etc -seems very nice for me

maybe we could make list of some reserve HG teams (just in case if anything happens to original 14)

We did, but some managers, including Wagner, do not have supporter and so cannot compete in a PL.

Looking through the list of teams, most are supporters. This, combined with the sudden silence or eagerness of managers in getting this HG league up and going for next season...is the only reason I even mention the possibility of a PL. It would certainly make everything easier, but then some teams would not be able to play.

Hi
f you need one HG team more i'm in.

Hi there, Chucarro. Whether we go with a 'Pick-Up' run league, or a "Private League," we will include you in the preparations. Thanks for putting your hand up. :-)

Hey, I have followed this thread for some time now. If you plan doing a Pick-Up league and still need a further team, then I would be able to complete as part of my team is HG, 7 players to be exact. So in an emergency, I could take part as well and play with these 7 for the league purposes. Hopefully over the next seasons I can extend the number of HG players in my roster and would be a more serious candidate for a HG-league.

Hey, I have followed this thread for some time now. If you plan doing a Pick-Up league and still need a further team, then I would be able to complete as part of my team is HG, 7 players to be exact. So in an emergency, I could take part as well and play with these 7 for the league purposes. Hopefully over the next seasons I can extend the number of HG players in my roster and would be a more serious candidate for a HG-league.

Hi there, Lennuk7. While we appreciate your offer, those teams here seem unanimous in a HG team being 100% HG. I, too, am currently partially HG, but will be 100% HG to start next season.

If you end up becoming 100% HG...let us know as we will definitely add you to our ranks :-)

Hello all HG teams (Including those who are working towards becoming one).

After careful consideration of what has occurred here in this forum, including the effort put in by managers like Wagner and Demars etc, and all those who have conversed here, as well also appreciating the challenges of creating a HG League using the Pick-Up tokens system, I have decided to create a Private League for 100% HG teams to compete in while the PickUp version continues to be worked on.

Both kinds of leagues (PickUp and Private) can run parallel to one another. This has some great benefits:

Those who are Supporters and 100% HG can compete in the Private League (link will be found here soon to the forum) and not worry about the issues a PickUp system creates. Eg. Setting of games, results etc etc.

A Private League will also allow the greater HG community to see (via the newly created forum) the results and interest HG leagues and teams are generating. This helps the PickUp HG League too as those managers who do not have supporter, can still compete with their HG team in the system being formed in this forum.

In fact, HG teams who have supporter, could perhaps compete in both the PickUp and Private Leagues.

Therefore, if you have supporter and are interested in participating in a HG Private League set to start at the beginning of next season, please keep an eye out for the new forum and link above to it (almost about to be initiated).

Likewise, for all those HG teams who do not have supporter but still want to compete in the HG League being created here using PickUp tokens, please continue to check this forum. Wagner, myself and others will, I hope, continue to prepare the league for the start of next season.


EDIT: See bolded text: PL to start at beginning of next season.


Last edited by MrJ at 2/20/2025 6:54:53 AM

Yes, that's what I thought. Just wanted to let you know that in a case of emergency, I would have at least a partially HG team. For me it probably still takes a couple of seasons before I could dream of being fully HG but then I will let you guys know.

Yes, that's what I thought. Just wanted to let you know that in a case of emergency, I would have at least a partially HG team. For me it probably still takes a couple of seasons before I could dream of being fully HG but then I will let you guys know.

No worries, LennuK7...

...we look forward to you joining us soon

Hello HG teams!

...it went dark here for awhile. I hope all teams are doing well as we move into the second half of Season 67.

So, with the Allstar break behind us, and the second half of the season in front of us, I think we should finalise the HGL as the start of Season 68 (when the HGL is set to begin) will arrive soon!
[....]

Wagner, or someone else will need to:

1. Set the rules and regulations for teams and games

2. Decide on whether MVP votes will be done, how and monitor it.


Anything else?

Hello again, and sorry for delay. Sometimes "real life" gets in the way. Of course I'm still in. Sometimes there are times when I need to divide my attention to many places, and then BB can suffer from that. And like I mentioned in PM to you, sometimes it can happen that I don't react to messages immediately if there aren't any that require immediate action ((such as your last forum post/opinion about "rating" teams (whether or not teams have purchased players in their roster and received some salary benefit by doing so, which, in short, I still have the same view on - we should be open about the financial benefits that teams have acquired through buying back their own players)).

I just noticed your forum message written Feb 16th as BB this time didn't decide give me visual notice about new forum messages (I have no idea why it sometimes gives visual reminder in a form of a red number and sometimes it doesn´t). So I noticed there seem to have been some new plans, that have already started forming, after not being responded in 4 days.

I am and will be part of this original BBHG league project, but I'll also let everyone know here in the forum; not hearing from me immediately doesn't mean I would've withdrawn. In such unlikely event, I will let people know here in the forum and not just disappear.

Having said that, like you mentioned, start of the BBHG league is closing in so we should start putting in more effort to finalize rules, penalties etc., and I can take a loot at these things with bit more time on my hands now.

After careful consideration of what has occurred here in this forum, including the effort put in by managers like Wagner and Demars etc, and all those who have conversed here, as well also appreciating the challenges of creating a HG League using the Pick-Up tokens system, I have decided to create a Private League for 100% HG teams to compete in while the PickUp version continues to be worked on.

Both kinds of leagues (PickUp and Private) can run parallel to one another. This has some great benefits:

Those who are Supporters and 100% HG can compete in the Private League (link will be found here soon to the forum) and not worry about the issues a PickUp system creates. Eg. Setting of games, results etc etc.

A Private League will also allow the greater HG community to see (via the newly created forum) the results and interest HG leagues and teams are generating. This helps the PickUp HG League too as those managers who do not have supporter, can still compete with their HG team in the system being formed in this forum.

In fact, HG teams who have supporter, could perhaps compete in both the PickUp and Private Leagues.

[....]

EDIT: See bolded text: PL to start at beginning of next season.

If I may give my opinion on this, after stating the obvious: this is not an attack in any form, even if it would sound like it as my opinions seem to differ on some parts. Opinions here should be taken with the understanding of me having high appreciation towards you - I see you as a smart and considerate person based on forum and BB mail messages, and I'm sure practically we all appreciate the major contribution you've given (and luckily will likely keep giving) to the HG community.

Having said that, I'd like to share some opposing views especially in terms of running parallel leagues.

FWIW: I do not have any means to try to prevent anyone from playing a homegrown private league.
However, I want to mention couple of things, why I consider this counterproductive and actually harmful for both leagues especially in long term.

So I quite strongly think this actually is a negative thing to run parallel leagues, as then it mixes up things even more. The "competition" on which one is the "real"/"true/"better" homegrown league starts eventually, and it divides attention to 2 different leagues, in terms of mental attention and in practical participation to the league(s) - I don't see all teams wanting to participate in 2 leagues.

It's like running 2 different "champions league" (or actually regular season) type of competitions parallel - it takes away from both leagues. Having a HG private league is something one could've had starting from season 1, and it's nothing to do with what I've planned here and what this conversation to begin with has been about (at least on my part). It was the whole point initially to make 1 league, and 1 league only that does never require you to have been purchased anything in order to be able to participate.

I know we do not have experience about possible challenges of organizing PU matches, but I suppose it shouldn't be a huge hassle as we discussed earlier, as long as teams are willing to do the work required (setting up PU matches) couple of times per season (plus playoffs time).

Also, given that the HG community isn't huge, it is less realistic to be able to run 2 different, but same kind of leagues parallel from year to year. And as many people are comfort seeking personalities, PL in that sense is easier that you don't have to do anything, and therefore having "a side/parallel HG private league" running simultaneously would be very bad for the actual BBHG league (in my eyes) in the long run. Also, the commitment to the leagues, and meaning of the results/games would be less if more than 1 such leagues would be run simultaneously. (While not perfect example, think NBA - what's the meaning of one regular season match when you play 82 of them)?

Doesn't seem to be anyone really engaged here and I'm not doing it all alone.

Maybe a HomeGrown Private League will have to be created?

Would be nice and easy. I could create quickly at start of next season for all those HG teams who can play :-)

I know that feeling - that's why it was so great to get you aboard to begin with. BBHG league (not PL league, the actual league) comes with some organizational work, and even though we don't have experience about how much work it'll cause for the administrator/staff, I believe it'd be best to share some tasks if possible.

I already mentioned this in another forum post, but not commenting to your February 16th post before today didn't mean that I would've ditched the original BBHG league, and this turn that took place in 3-4 days time window might not be a positive direction in terms of longevity of the original BBHG league vision/idea that we have been discussing about since the later part of 2024.

The original BBHG league is likely the only league I will likely ever be working on, so all my efforts will go towards this league. Having said that, being HG team means in my case having to spend countless of hours per season towards avoiding relegation in my regular BB league - a time which is away from the all the other stuff (such as forming a structure/rules for the new BBHG league and trying to give thoughful replies to forum posts). But we still have quite a lot time before season starts, so together we will get things started in terms of original BBHG league, which I acually hope would be the only BBHG league that will start.

If for some reason "the train cart" that has taken a new direction between 16th and 20th of February (in terms of plans of a HG private league by MrJ) couldn't be made to join the original train from which it departed from (like I mentioned, I think it's way, way better for both leagues if we'd focus on this one original league only to make it long lived league - we have enough competition in terms of things within and outside of BB, so that's I see it as counterproductive to create "competition within HG community"), then at the very least it should have completely another forum thread into where conversation will go. Having said that, this another forum thread would be a stitch in a would sized of a whale, so it doesn't remove all the other problems associated with running parallel leagues.

It is good to hear from you again, Wagner. I apologise if you thought I was upset with your lack of presence recently. I was actually referring to the thread in general rather than you specifically. If you or I aren't posting, it seems silent. This doesn't bode well, in my opinion, for having managers assist in completing this PU version of a HG League. This is why I have put the whole Private League question out there.

I must say that I understand where you are coming from in everything you have noted. However, I am not sure whether I have the energy to continue working through the PickUp system knowing that it will always be reliant on a couple of managers to orchestrate everything, while relying on all participating managers to do their part with pickup tokens (the core of the system) and, as such, is prone to mistakes and failure.

With a Private League version, there cannot be any mistakes after the league is launched, other than managers not fielding 100% HG players. Yet, I have prepared a couple simple consequences for that. Which leads me to the rules and regulations we were discussing for the PU system...where we don't seem to agree on the level of complexity the rules require. I prefer simple.

I think we have a difference of opinion here as I envisaged the HG League being run simply with minimal complications for managers. I also appreciate that you want a PU system rather than a Private League as you do not have supporter and have been honest and upfront about the HG League being free and accessible for everyone. Previously, I have agreed with that. However, as I started to go over everything we have discussed and debated in this forum in regards to setting this HG League up, I started to feel that there were too many extra considerations/problems that aren't an issue at all if a PL is utilised instead.

As it stands right now I am torn. On the one hand I want to continue what I have started in helping you and others create the PU version of the HGL simply because I don't like to quit and it would provide a 'free' league for all; yet, on the other hand, I really like the low-maintenance a PL provides, which is already familiar, organised and ready-to-go.


Therefore, I am simply going to ask this question to all of those managers who have been participating in this forum, are still taking the time to read these posts, and are still keen to play in a HG League:


Do managers want us to finalise this PickUp version of the HG League, or would they prefer a HG Private League instead?

Wagner, you and I have been so busy 'deciding' the elements of the HG league, that we have not given full voice to those wishing to participate...specifically, what form it should take.

Last edited by MrJ at 2/22/2025 4:44:12 AM