BuzzerBeater Forums

The thing is, Jordan made Chicago into a consistent champion, and when he left, Chicago went 13-37, 17-65, and 15-67 the next three seasons, and this drop came when a 35 year old Michael Jordan left, not a 27 year old in his prime star player.

First off if you had read my post you'd see that yes I believe Lebron has considerable skill, but he hasn't been around long enough or done enough to take a "greatest ever" title.

And to your question, I'd have to say that yes he could for sure burn Bird and Baylor, Dr.J I'm not really sure on. Hondo I believe could slow him down just by being so relentless, while Pippen could contain him on the perimeter if not inside. But on the flip side do you really believe Lebron could shut down any of those players, aside from Pippen?

And finally, well he wasn't in Cleveland last season was he?

I think the important thing to keep in mind is that they're all fighting for second place behind Detlef Schrempf.

Are you really questioning LeBron being a great defender? No, you're probably right LeBron just gets rolled by scrubs night after night, plays absolutely no defense at all....OR he completely shut down last years MVP in the playoffs which no one was able to do all year long. But no he's probably not that good. And no he wasn't in Cleveland last season, that was my point, he left and they went from being title contenders to being slightly above D League status.

Listen if you don't wanna call him the greatest at his position just because he hasn't been around forever then that's all you breh. I mean he'll probably fall off now, he'll go from being the best player in the league to being the next Brian Scalabrine. Can't really hate on someone for being young. Seven individually great years in Cleveland surround by Delonte West and Boobie Gibson (sick) and then getting a team full of players playing together in the league for a couple months to the Finals, yeah he hasn't done ish so far. I mean the rest of those guys did it all by themselves, what was I thinking?

His attitude is holding him back from being great? Jordan didn't have a "I'mma get mine" attitude at all...

And Derrick Rose is no Bird, Baylor, Dr.J, or even Hondo. Derrick Rose is still young and is a very one dimensional player as of now, and his style plays right into Lebron's defense- which is being more athletic than everyone else. And yeah I've seen him get rolled- some guy named Terry in a pretty important game, who's not half the shooter Bird was.

The White Mamba has more rings than LBJ.

Never said Rose was any of those guys. Or even close. I said he was the MVP and burning kids all year long...until LeBron locked him down. And no Terry isn't Bird, but he's in the league because of his shooting. He's not Shaq out there jacking up 3's. Actually his career 3 pt. % is better than MJ's who from what I remember wasn't too bad of shooter. And before you jump on my nuts about that I'm not saying Jason Terry is MJ, just stating facts.

Ok by me, he played great D vs. Rose.

Sidenote: Terry's 3pt % is also very similar to Birds(actually slightly better), but % isn't everything.

Here's a list of awards/stats for each of the 6. And I at least am not arguing skill level, Lebron is on of the most talented individuals by far, but greatness instead.
(Defensive teams not selected until 1968-so no Baylor)(Stats are NBA/ABA to include Dr.J)
Lebron:
2xMVP
7xAllstar
2x2nd team all NBA
5x1st team all NBA
3x1st team all defense
#73 in points
#74 in assists

Baylor:
11xAllstar
10x1st team all NBA
#26 Rebounds
#27 Points

Erving:
5xABA allstar
11xNBA allstar
3xABA MVP
1xNBA MVP
1x2nd team all ABA
4x1st team all ABA
1x1st team all defense(ABA)
2x2nd team all NBA
5x1st team all NBA
2xABA champion
1xNBA champion
#32 Rebounds
#49 Assists
#7 Steals
#21 Blocks
#5 Points

Hondo:
13xNBA allstar
6x2nd team all NBA
4x1st team all NBA
3x2nd team all defense NBA
5x1st team all defense NBA
8xNBA champion
1xFinals MVP
#71 Rebounds
#28 Assists
#15 Points

Pippen:
7xAllstar
2x3rd team all NBA
2x2nd team all NBA
3x1st team all NBA
2x2nd team all defense NBA
8x1st team all defense NBA
6xNBA champion
#82 Rebounds
#26 Assists
#6 Steals
#88 Blocks
#52 Points

Bird:
12xNBA allstar
3xNBA MVP
1x2nd team all NBA
9x1st team all NBA
3x2nd team all defense NBA
3xNBA champion
2xFinals MVP
#51 Rebounds
#34 Assists
#30 Steals
#32 Points

Jordon did have that attitude yes however Lebron has more of an AI attitude where yeah hes gonna get his own numbers but his team will never achieve anything more than a finals appearance